It’s not about the obstacles; it’s about the courage to keep asking questions. In this episode, host Marc Scheff sits down with Brigitte Cutshall, a powerhouse of resilience and creativity. Founder of Gemini Media and host of Real Things Living Podcast, Brigitte’s journey has been anything but ordinary. From overcoming two bouts of breast cancer and a rare brain tumor to channeling her publishing expertise into helping others find joy after health setbacks, Brigitte is a true advocate for thriving against the odds. They dive into her unique approach to mindfulness, her creative ventures like the Real Things Living Coloring Journal, and the power of curiosity in navigating life’s challenges. Tune in for an inspiring conversation filled with wisdom, creativity, and practical insights for living a fulfilling life.
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Watch the episode here
Listen to the podcast here
The Art Of Healing: Thriving After Unexpected Health Issues With Brigitte Cutshall
Welcome to the show. Our guest is Brigitte Cutshall. She is the founder of Gemini Media and the host of the Real Things Living Podcast. I was on her podcast and she sent me this incredible book, which we talk about on the show because it’s part of her creative journey. Part of her journey includes some pretty unexpected health issues, which is where she focuses now. She takes all her background in publishing and other areas to help people find thriving lives after these unexpected health issues. There’s a lot more in the episode. Check it out, and I’ll see you on the other side.
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Welcome back to the Art of Transformation, where we share stories of transformation and give you tools to get you there. I’m excited to have this guest. I was on her podcast and we had such a great conversation. I said, “You have to come on my podcast. You have such a great story.” Brigitte, welcome.
Thank you so much, Marc. I appreciate it. I’m glad we connected.
Real Things Living Coloring Journal
It was such a pleasure being on your podcast. We had such a great conversation there. You sent me this wonderful gift. It’s something I absolutely love. It was right up my alley. I can’t believe that you actually made this book. You had it ready. Tell us about this book that you sent me.
It’s called the Real Things Living Coloring Journal. I think the subtitle is Add Some Color to Your Life. I had the idea during COVID because I saw so many people stressed out. People talk a lot about meditation and all that good stuff, but everyone deals with trying to focus and meditate in different ways. I thought a coloring journal would be cool because everybody does coloring books or journals. I thought, “Let’s put this together where you can color with a coloring pencil, the way my artwork is, and then write down your thoughts afterward.”
That’s why I thought of it as a journal because you don’t know somebody. You never know. I had the idea during COVID and I gave them out as gifts. People liked it and like you, they weren’t expecting that because it’s different from regular journals. I thought it would be more fun for people. I was trying to make it fun. Everybody was feeling stressed out. That’s what it was.
I don’t know if I posted this, but I believe in the power and the healing properties of things like mindfulness and meditation. I don’t have a strong meditation practice. Every morning when I wake up, I don’t look at my phone for the first hour of my day. I try to lie in bed for the first however many minutes and let my mind unspool. Maybe my eyes are closed or maybe they’re open, but I don’t necessarily sit in the middle of the day.
When you sent me this book, it struck me that if I set aside a little time every day to finish a whole page or to get some coloring done, and when you’re in that creative space, that isn’t productive. You’re not creating a painting you’re trying to sell or something like that. I’m doing it for my own enjoyment. That’s when so many ideas come to us.
I don’t meditate in the middle of the day, but I get up first thing in the morning and I like to do yoga and stretch. As you get into my chapter of life, you have to stretch. It’s calming for me. I thought the coloring pencil aspect of the art was making me more detailed. I think that’s my writing and editing background. I’m so detailed, but also I’m doing it with colors. I find that it helps me focus.
The other part of that story that I love is that it wasn’t necessarily part of your usual routine, you didn’t do coloring books before this, but you saw a need that people would find useful. I don’t imagine you made a million dollars on the book.
No. I give them away too. That’s part of it.
That desire and that ability to tap into creative ideas, has that always been a part of who you are? Where did that start?
It always has been part of me. As kids, we’re that way. In general, we’re that way. I’m grateful to think back that my parents were okay with it. I looked at things differently for some reason. That’s just me. I always wrote. I always made up stories. I was a storyteller. A lot of it has to do with the age group that I’m in. We were free roamers. That was helpful, but I got so happy when I was doing something creative. You can help solve some problems. Being around my brother who was older than me, I had to be creative to get around his crazy crap.
That’s what it was. I would write a newspaper and I would give up the sport. I don’t know why I was always into that. I got into taking pictures. I was fortunate that my parents let me do that. I knew I was that way, but I was also good at math. My mother would remind me, “You’re good at math.” I’m like, “I don’t care.” That’s what I would say. It’s good to understand that, but you have to apply it differently.
In school, back then, we had more art classes. I don’t know if they have now. They had more. They let you express that. It’s getting some attention too. I think creativity, especially, I raised two boys and I’m still here. I’m kidding. Mom of boys don’t live long. I’m being sarcastic. I encourage them to be creative. Everybody is creative in a different way.
My younger son used to take everything apart because he wanted to know how things worked, and that’s being creative. He’s now a software engineer. I was like, “Go for it. Do it if it’s important to you.” My older son is very creative with words, like his mother in a way. You want to encourage that because sometimes in our culture, this is my opinion, we’re trying to fit everybody in a box, and I’ve never liked that. It’s probably my rebellious nature a little bit. I don’t mean rebellious in a bad way.
Sometimes in our culture, we’re trying to fit everybody in a box.
I don’t think it’s a bad word. I would almost encourage it. It’s funny though, I have two young kids. One is a teenager now. He brought a sandwich. He’s being very sweet today. Having two kids, you want to develop or at least, I want to develop resilient people. I want to build resilient people who are going to live their own dreams in the world. I do want them to question the status quo. I do want them to question authority. Not always though.
It depends on the situation.
It’s a fine line between saying that it’s important to have some critical theory approach to things, like questioning things, “Why are we doing it this way? Is this the way that we’ve done it? Is there a new way that we should be doing it?” but also, “Clean your dishes. We’re not going to talk about that.”
I’m so grateful. My parents believed in reading. My mom’s second husband raised me. He was a schoolteacher. He always had books around. I think that helped a lot too. Back in the day, we had the old-school leather encyclopedia.
We learned through that when we were kids.
I would read that. I would learn and I would like to tweak it. I’m one of those kids who likes to learn things. I also played music a little bit.
I want to go back to when you would read the encyclopedia, you sit down.
I think that’s what it was. I probably started doing it because my brother would tell me something that I knew was a lie. I would go to the encyclopedia shelf and look it up. I would read about it. People Google that now. Back then, you had to use your encyclopedia. I’m like, “This is cool,” and I would continue reading. I did have regular books too. We didn’t have access to the internet or much. Our TV had three channels. You had to watch something at a certain time of day.
I don’t remember when VHS tapes came out, but the only thing I liked to watch on TV when I was young was probably MTV when it came out. I think I was in middle school. I can’t remember, but that’s where musicians were trying to make some money. I also liked music and I did play the keyboard a little bit. I played the clarinet, but I learned that I didn’t like it. It’s crazy. It’s something I learned. You should let your children try different things. That’s why my parents let me get involved with sports and music. I learned that I liked the sports aspect better, which is weird. I don’t know why.
Why is that? What’s weird about it?
I shouldn’t say weird, but back then, it was not normal for a girl to be in sports.
What years are we talking about, if you don’t mind?
We’re talking about the late ‘70s. I was born in 1965. I’m sharing my age. I’ll be 59. It was not normal back then. You had some women in the Olympics, but when I was starting high school, they had Title IX.
Mary Lou Retton.
I’m older than Mary Lou Retton. Title IX was passed in the ‘70s so that women could participate in sports in college. I was always fascinated with sports because of my older brother. I wanted to emulate him. I was always trying to keep up with him. He was older and taller than me, but I learned and I had so much fun in that. I was risky and rebellious. I did gymnastics. I was good at gymnastics. That was tough. I tried different things. I wasn’t afraid to do that. It has to do with my parents. I had freedom and I was trying to be like my brother, but I ended up doing everything.
Becoming A Health Advocate
I want to ask you about that because, in a way, it ties into what you do now. You work with folks. I’m going to cheat a little bit and I’m going to read what you wrote over here. You’re a health advocate who is passionate about encouraging others to lead their happiest and healthiest lives. You say that you work with people who are interested in thriving after dealing with unexpected personal health issues.
If you’re willing, I’d love for you to share some of what you’ve gone through. I’m curious to know how that encouragement or mindset of being willing to almost be like a pioneer in some ways in your family, like being a woman in the late ‘70s, Title IX getting passed while you’re a conscious person. Can you tell us a little bit about what got you focused on the line of work that you do now?
In the line of work I do, I’ve always loved books. I’ve always had that weaved in there. People ask how I’m still active because it’s important to me and always has been. I’ve had some unexpected health issues. It’s not genetic. It’s listening to my body and asking questions. For those who are tuning in, I’ve had breast cancer twice and, in between, a rare primary brain tumor.
We would not have discovered this if knowing something was off and I just listened to a doctor who was going to prescribe medicine. I was like, “Something is not right. I’m not taking that pill. I need to find out what the root cause is.” That’s when I worked only with doctors who allowed questions and were part of the research. They’re involved with that. That’s why I’m still here. The rare primary brain tumor that I had was discovered after the first breast cancer because some weird things were going on.
I was like, “Why is this happening to me?” The brain tumor I have is from radiation exposure. We don’t know where that came from. That’s an issue with the environment. We don’t know. I was exposed to it at some point when I was younger. They did genetic testing on me. I don’t have a genetic predisposition for this. That’s why I got into the environment stuff. Listening to my body has made me curious. Being curious helps you figure problems out.
I was going to ask about that because it seems like there’s so much in our society that almost encourages us to suffer through whatever, like ignore these things. Certainly, the healthcare system doesn’t do anything for that. There are so many hoops to jump through, even if you have good insurance to get coverage, to get an appointment, and to do all these things. It’s almost easier to ignore things, but that’s not what I’m hearing you did. Being in tune with your body is a good thing, but also being curious and not accepting “I don’t know” as an answer.
I had two young boys at the time and that was my beacon. I had and still have a wonderful and supportive husband who puts up with his wife’s curiosity. I found some great doctors who didn’t know. This brain tumor was rare. I had to go to places like Chicago and fly out of here to figure out what to do. I looked at my options. It’s because I was curious and I was asking questions. The doctors were thinking too. That’s what we need more of. Doctors need more openness. I don’t want to go down that rabbit hole about the healthcare system. I found doctors who were involved in research projects. They’re more likely to look at different stuff. That’s why I’m still here.
That’s why when this cancer came back. It was because we couldn’t kill that brain tumor. That’s what was causing everything. When it was all done, all the surgeries and the treatment that I had, I was like, “I am going to run again because my brain and body were telling me she needs this.” There’s science behind the data that exercise helps with healing. I had to get physical therapy again because you’re not using your body constantly going through all that stuff, but it helped me heal. It brings me joy, and it makes me continue to be curious and help others. People are inspired when they learn about my story.
That curiosity, you said it well. In the coach training that I’ve done and that I continue to do, one of the refrains that I keep hearing especially from one of my coaches, Dermot Butterly, is that the key to effective coaching, if you want to support somebody or however you want to frame it, is to get them from whatever state they’re in, to a more resourceful state, a more inspired state, a more creative state, a more fulfilled state, or a more healthy state. The fundamental tool that we have in the work that we do is to be curious and ask questions.
You were well set up to translate all of this experience because you did it. We’ve heard this now. You did it when you were a kid. You tried all these different things. You’re at the forefront of things like Title IX, and then you have serious health setbacks, but it was your curiosity and the support of the people in your life that got you through that. When you’re working with people, how is that? When someone comes to you, what are they looking for? What do they want? I know there’s a difference, but what do they want and what do they get?
That’s a good point. With all my experiences, I have learned to ask them questions based on the nuances of what they’re saying and then listen to what they’re telling me, then I can come back with options or solutions that they’re looking for. Does that make sense? All those experiences in my life, it’s like, “I’m glad you asked this question. I never even thought about that.” I’m applying those personal experiences to the business aspect, and I stood out too in my younger years in the business world because I brought that curiosity forward.
That wasn’t normal back then. That’s what made me stand out. I was always very curious about every business aspect, and they liked that. I’m grateful that sometimes you’re like, “Why did I say this?” or “Why did I ask that question?” but it makes the client or whoever you’re talking to think, “I never thought about that.” I want people to think. That’s what I’m helping them come up with. I can’t help everybody. They want to have some help too if you can help.
There’s this whole idea in our world, whether you’re doing mentoring, coaching, consulting, or if you’re a therapist. I’ve seen this with people. Can you imagine trying to sit somebody down in a therapist’s office who doesn’t want to be there? It’s not going to go right.
You’re not going to get very far. I don’t know if I could be a therapist. That would be hard. It’s similar to coaching. I’m a coach for running. I used to coach younger kids. I’m helping the Atlanta track club. I try to be an example and ask them questions like what’s their goal and I help them. Especially with running, some people love it and some people hate it. Some people want to do it. If they don’t want to do it, they’re not going to find a way. They had a motive. It’s about motivating. My sister is a schoolteacher. I don’t know if I could be a school teacher. It’s a tough job, but in a way, a coach is similar to a teacher.
Working With Brigitte
Except for people who aren’t there against their will necessarily. My kids are in school because we haven’t given them the option. Coaching is a little bit different. People have to be interested. They have to either reach out to them or they reach out to you. I’m curious about the people that you work with. If somebody comes to you and works with you because they had a major health setback, what’s the most common issue or problem that they’re trying to solve? Where is somebody when they want to come to work with Brigitte?
Part of it is they don’t know how to put their stuff together each day. Does that make sense? It can be overwhelming. I help people a lot by educating them on food. I got certified in nutrition back in the day because it helped me heal. If you have any health issues, what you put in your body is critical. I talk about that. I also encourage them to find some movement that they like. I’m not going to tell them to run, but they have to find something that they’re going to be consistent with. That’s what it is.
If you have any health issues, what you put in your body is critical.
I don’t like running. I like having just run. That’s the feeling that I like. If I could skip to the part where I just did a run, that would be great. Are people coming to you when they’re in the middle of this health issue or is it more like they’ve overcome something?
It’s usually after they’ve overcome something. They want to get motivated to continue and make a change. That’s part of it. Making a change is hard.
It is the understatement of the year.
I had to hire someone to help me, a doctor, back in the day. I learned that I had an issue with casein protein, which is part of dairy. That’s addicting. I had to have some accountability from him. He gave me some great tools and I felt better. Some people think I’m weird because I don’t have dairy anymore, but it’s not worth feeling the pain the next day. I had to have accountability. That’s what it is. He was able to help me figure it out. He’s an integrative endocrinologist. Coaches do that. I help after they’re seeing a doctor if that makes sense. I’m not a doctor.
What I also heard you say is that part of what’s built into working with you is a sense of accountability. I can say I want to quit sweets or smoking or whatever. I can say all these things, but if there’s no accountability, then what is it? It’s going to be hard because these things are addicting, like these behaviors and the food that we put in our bodies.
It’s harder than what people think. I try to be a good role model for people. I’m not perfect. I have a lot of chocolates.
Sorry, I thought you were perfect.
You have to embrace that. I want you to be you, but you do have to have accountability. Maybe you have an issue with something like smoking. I didn’t know I had an issue with dairy. The casein protein, for example, takes four hours before your body can start digesting it. That’s why there wasn’t a connection. I didn’t know there was such a thing as casein protein. Apparently, it’s common now.
It is very common. I know a lot of people who aren’t allergic, but they have a sensitivity. My wife is the same. There are a number of things that she doesn’t eat. I do all the cooking. There are things that I don’t. It doesn’t agree with her, and it’s not even. Maybe she saw an endocrinologist for some of this stuff, but I’m not sure. Fundamentally, she’s listening to her body and paying attention like, “Every time I have a slice of pizza, I feel like crap. What is it?” Be willing to look at those issues. What’s the end goal here? We want to live long lives. We want to have an impact on the world. We want to be there for our kids and our families. We want to enjoy the time that we have here.
I want to enjoy it. You mentioned the pizza thing. They originally thought I had a gluten issue. They tested me for that, and it’s not. Back in the day, the marketing aspect was that you got to have your dairy. As I have gotten older, my body gets even more sensitive to certain things if I have something too much. That’s why I got into the nutrition aspect. You look at the labels. Your wife probably does that too. I can’t believe that certain breads have milk in them. Why would you put milk in bread?
Milk and lots of sugar. I saw a funny thing, I think it was in France, about Subway, the sandwich shop. They had some court ruling that they could not ethically say that they serve their sandwiches on bread because, based on the ingredients, there were all kinds of stuff in there. It’s not actually bread. I forget what they said it was. Maybe they said it was cake.
I remember reading about that.
Embrace Life
Very strange thing. You said you were born in ’65. I was born about ten years later, and I’m hitting a new chapter now too. What was one piece of advice you would give to somebody who is twenty years old now?
It’s okay to embrace and try different things. It’s good, but then only stick to things that you enjoy doing. If you don’t like it, you shouldn’t do it. That’s my opinion. I know sometimes you have to push through. It depends on the situation, but as you get to different chapters, focus on what’s important because life is short. That’s what I’ve learned.
Life is short and you have to embrace life. My first book was called Real Things: 6 Ways to Embrace Life. I wrote that after that last aggressive cancer. I wanted to inspire people because life is short. You want to help. I want to help people. I enjoy coaching people to run. I don’t know. I like it because I get excited about it. I know what to look for because I’ve done it for like 45 years.
We know the benefits.
I know the benefit of it, Don’t push yourself too hard on things. Don’t be so hard on yourself. The main thing is to focus on what’s important in your life because life is short. You want to be there for your children if you have children. Surround yourself with the right people, positive people, not people who are going to talk down to you. I’ve learned that. I’m sure you’ve heard that before. When people talk negatively to me, I smile and walk away. It’s better than making the situation worse.
Focus on what’s important in your life because life is short.
Creating Change
I think this is the hardest thing to do, and I’ve done this. This is not lip service. Some of these experiences were some of the hardest experiences of my life. One of the very hard things I think about is change. I imagine you deal with people who deal with changes forced on them, whether it’s a health issue, a forced slowdown, or something that makes them change their pace.
As we embrace this idea that we want to become our best selves or create our next act or the next chapter, we want to be healthier, more vibrant, more successful, and all these things. We start to examine our friendships with the people who are in our lives. It’s the hardest thing in the world to sit there and realize that this person is not on this journey or this next chapter with me. Have you seen that come up with your work?
Sometimes I have certain clients, They’re not instinctive. They’re not going to follow your coaching or your advice. It depends on their situation. They have to be open to it. Some people are reactive, and I can’t judge them. At the same time, my time is important too.
I’m glad you named that. There are a lot of coaches in the world now. I think there’s maybe a sense that we’ll work with anybody. I appreciate that that’s not the case with you. I certainly think about it this way because if someone is forced to sit in a Zoom or a room with me, we’re not going to get anywhere. It doesn’t feel good. They’re not being curious. They’re looking at the clock.
They’re wondering what it is that I’m going to give them, which is not what coaching is about. It’s about evoking the truth that’s within the person in the room. If they’re not willing to look at that, then you can’t get anything right. It’s tough. Ideally, you can filter that before they become clients. Sometimes, it happens and things change.
What advice or tips would you give to somebody, whether or not they’re a coach, but even in people’s lives when they’re creating a change, when they’re evolving either professionally or personally? They’re realizing maybe they’ve cut out a certain activity, or they want to be healthier with their eating or whatever. We have pressures in our lives to go back to how we were. What advice would you give to people who are on that journey?
I’ve learned this from someone I met about eight years ago. Pause in the situation, breathe, think about it, and then reflect on that. It’s good to write that down. Try not to react because it’s a situation. If you write it down, think about it and reflect. That’s what I mean by thinking about it. That’ll help you move forward.
I’m a tactile person, and writing it down helps. Some people might want to record their voices with their thoughts. Whatever fits you. I’m one of those who have a journal. I don’t write in it every day, but I have reflections on certain things. That will help you. Going back to the accountability, I’ll tell my husband stuff because he’ll remind me. I’m fortunate that we support each other. We’re so opposite.
You have someone that you can plant your flag with and say, “I’m saying that I want to do this differently.” I’m so grateful for the support of my wife for a number of things where I’m like, “I don’t want to do this anymore, I do want to do more of this.” “I thought you said you didn’t want to do that.”
They’ll remind you. The same with him. This is funny about the dairy thing. He’s from Wisconsin. You can imagine how much dairy this man has eaten, but he’ll remind me if we go out, “Honey, this has dairy.” He looks for that for me, and that’s nice because he knows the next day, I’ll feel bad and it’s body aches. That’s what it is. You have to have somebody, at least one person, to share what you want to change with. You don’t have to make it public. It’s helpful. Sadly, some people don’t have a confidant to share with.
They could always come talk to you.
That’s what it’s all about. You have someone you can trust to pause, breathe, and reflect with. Share that with someone you trust because they’re going to remind you.
It reminds me of that great and very famous Viktor Frankl quote. He was a Holocaust concentration camp survivor. He wrote a number of books. One is Man’s Search for Meaning. It’s a tough book to read but inspiring though. He says, “Between stimulus and response, there is a space. In that space is our power to choose our response. In our response lies our growth and freedom.” Hearing you say, “Pause, breathe, and reflect, “ I hear an echo there of his wise words.
These are different words, but they have similar meanings.
Sometimes we need to hear things fifteen different ways. On the fifteenth, we go, “That makes sense. I know I’ve heard it a thousand times, but now it’s clicking in for me, or maybe I’m old enough to understand.”
It’s so helpful. I’m so glad that with this technology, we’re able to share more stories and connect with other people. That’s a good thing. That’s a good side of tech. We can learn so much from each other. That is so awesome to inspire and motivate other people.
Connect With Brigitte
We could probably have four more podcasts of content here, but I do have to close things up. I want to encourage people to go find this coloring book because it’s fantastic. If people are interested in finding you or finding out more about what you do or are interested in talking with you or working with you, where can they go?
The best place is my website, which is my name, BridgetCutchall.com. I’m active on LinkedIn as well. That’s the good thing and that’s the best way to do it. On my website, there’s a page where my books are and so forth. I try to keep it simple.
We’ll have a link to the website. I’m going to add a link to the coloring book because I love it so much. Brigitte, thank you so much for joining me and sharing some of your story and some of your insights. It was wonderful to have you.
Thank you again, Marc. This is awesome. I’m so glad we connected.
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Thanks for tuning in to this episode. I love talking to other coaches because it’s interesting to hear what their criteria are for working with someone. Everybody has a niche. They like to work with this person or that person because of their own life experiences. One thing that I keep hearing, and we heard it in this episode, is the idea of being coachable. If you have time to leave a comment if you’re listening on any of the platforms or if you’re watching on YouTube, I’d love to know what you think being coachable means.
Are you being coachable in your life? How are you doing that? Are there people in your life that you find coachable or not coachable? I’d love to be in discussion with you about it. As always, I’d love for you to like and follow, and please share this episode with friends. Thanks again for tuning in, and I’ll see you at the next episode.
Important Links:
- Brigitte Cutshall
- Real Things Living Podcast
- Real Things Living Coloring Journal
- LinkedIn – Brigitte Cutshall
- www.Instagram.com/brigittecutshall
- Real Things: 6 Ways to Embrace Life
About Brigitte Cutshall
Brigitte is the founder of Gemini Media, a creative enforcer, host of Real Things Living podcast, and has authored several books. She is also a health advocate who is passionate about encouraging others to lead their happiest, healthiest lives. She bring 30+ years experience in the publishing industry to help others share their stories and messages of hope.
